October 20, 201410 yr comment_89743 Warren Moon in the CFL and Warren Moon in the NFL is skewed because of the difference in the games. Hence why if we're labeling QB's under a category, you have to sort of alter the definition from true pocket passer and scrambler.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89744 Collaros at the start of the season was being asked to stay in the pocket. He was not effective until the right adjustments were made. You can look at CFL or NFL...the best QB's are pocket passers. Ray, Calvillo, Brady, Manning, et. al. Sure there are some effective scramblers, but the QB's who have had the most long term success are the pocket passers. And really, if you look at the OL the Bombers put on the field this season, it was ridiculous that they didn't perform better with three Americans starting. If they were starting 4 or 5 Canadians, you could argue that the OL is a long term project. But the fact is they aren't, and they should be finding better OL down south. Doug Flutie is the greatest QB and player the CFL has ever had.............. not a pocket QB.Warren Moon, Jackie Parker, Damon Allen, Russ Jackson, I can go all day, were not pocket QB's. True. But more recently they have been pocket passers. My main point is that we shouldn't be expecting a QB to make up for a subpar OL, given how hard it has been to find a franchise QB. The reason that the sub-par O-line looks so sub-sub-par is that Willy is standing there like a statue in Central Park and the pigeons are converging upon him. The sub-par O-liine was no better last night until Marve showed up and invited the Stamps D to run a steeplechase event were he was the rabbit. This also opened the holes that Cotton ran through so convincingly by spreading out the Stamps front 7.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89745 Read this: http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bigten&id=61338&src=desktop Maybe I'm wrong about this, but all that link says is that Marve was playing with a torn ACL at the time. Nothing about it healing afterward or him having surgery afterward to fix it or being removed etc. I'd like some clarification on this, because I have a real hard time believing that he's playing without an ACL in his left knee.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89747 Read this: http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bigten&id=61338&src=desktopMaybe I'm wrong about this, but all that link says is that Marve was playing with a torn ACL at the time. Nothing about it healing afterward or him having surgery afterward to fix it or being removed etc.I'd like some clarification on this, because I have a real hard time believing that he's playing without an ACL in his left knee. I'm no medical doctor but the headline says he has no ACL. If you read the article it says he tore it for the 3rd time and it was never repaired. Hence no ACL.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89752 Collaros at the start of the season was being asked to stay in the pocket. He was not effective until the right adjustments were made. You can look at CFL or NFL...the best QB's are pocket passers. Ray, Calvillo, Brady, Manning, et. al. Sure there are some effective scramblers, but the QB's who have had the most long term success are the pocket passers. And really, if you look at the OL the Bombers put on the field this season, it was ridiculous that they didn't perform better with three Americans starting. If they were starting 4 or 5 Canadians, you could argue that the OL is a long term project. But the fact is they aren't, and they should be finding better OL down south. Doug Flutie is the greatest QB and player the CFL has ever had.............. not a pocket QB. Warren Moon, Jackie Parker, Damon Allen, Russ Jackson, I can go all day, were not pocket QB's. Ricky Ray, Calvio - best CFL qbs in the past 7 years.. Pocket Passers.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89757 Damon Allen was a pretty average QB who lasted a long time.facepalm statemetn of the year. Remember the Argos' '04 Grey Cup win? Allen was basically a game manager for them Umm he still won it, and at how old... Pretty impressive considering how banged up he got because of his playign style. 394 passing TDS and 93 rushing tds vs only 278 interceptions. 4 x Grey Cup Champ. 3 x Grey Cup MVP 1 time CFL MOP Yet he's a lucky, average, long long time QB according to some of you. Ridiculous. It's like you think to be a good QB you HAVE to be amazing at sitting in the pocket 90% of the time and have a completion percentage over 65. 11,920 career rushing yards. It's not a fluke he won 4 grey cups, it's harder to defend a guy that could do what he did as well as he did, then it is to defend an Anthony Calvillo.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89758 Marve is the best QB we've seen since Dinwiddie Is that a compliment or insult?
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89761 Collaros at the start of the season was being asked to stay in the pocket. He was not effective until the right adjustments were made. You can look at CFL or NFL...the best QB's are pocket passers. Ray, Calvillo, Brady, Manning, et. al. Sure there are some effective scramblers, but the QB's who have had the most long term success are the pocket passers. And really, if you look at the OL the Bombers put on the field this season, it was ridiculous that they didn't perform better with three Americans starting. If they were starting 4 or 5 Canadians, you could argue that the OL is a long term project. But the fact is they aren't, and they should be finding better OL down south. Doug Flutie is the greatest QB and player the CFL has ever had.............. not a pocket QB.Warren Moon, Jackie Parker, Damon Allen, Russ Jackson, I can go all day, were not pocket QB's. True. But more recently they have been pocket passers. My main point is that we shouldn't be expecting a QB to make up for a subpar OL, given how hard it has been to find a franchise QB. The reason that the sub-par O-line looks so sub-sub-par is that Willy is standing there like a statue in Central Park and the pigeons are converging upon him. The sub-par O-liine was no better last night until Marve showed up and invited the Stamps D to run a steeplechase event were he was the rabbit. This also opened the holes that Cotton ran through so convincingly by spreading out the Stamps front 7. 1. I suspect Bighill and co. will be prepared and quite happy to chase Marve next week. 2. Ray plays a style similar to Willy. All Willy needs is some play makers who can be the rabbits. 3. Considering the beating Reilly took, I guess Willy would be dead if he'd played for the Esks last year.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89766 Damon Allen was a pretty average QB who lasted a long time.facepalm statemetn of the year. Remember the Argos' '04 Grey Cup win? Allen was basically a game manager for them Umm he still won it, and at how old... Pretty impressive considering how banged up he got because of his playign style. 394 passing TDS and 93 rushing tds vs only 278 interceptions. 4 x Grey Cup Champ. 3 x Grey Cup MVP 1 time CFL MOP Yet he's a lucky, average, long long time QB according to some of you. Ridiculous. It's like you think to be a good QB you HAVE to be amazing at sitting in the pocket 90% of the time and have a completion percentage over 65. 11,920 career rushing yards. It's not a fluke he won 4 grey cups, it's harder to defend a guy that could do what he did as well as he did, then it is to defend an Anthony Calvillo. No different than saying a scrambling QB is better suited to the CFL. It comes down to game planning and having the right personnel surrounding him. With that many interceptions a QB should have over 500 touchdown passes. And no, I'm not going to google any of Calvillo's stats.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89768 Read this: http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bigten&id=61338&src=desktopMaybe I'm wrong about this, but all that link says is that Marve was playing with a torn ACL at the time. Nothing about it healing afterward or him having surgery afterward to fix it or being removed etc.I'd like some clarification on this, because I have a real hard time believing that he's playing without an ACL in his left knee. I'm no medical doctor but the headline says he has no ACL. If you read the article it says he tore it for the 3rd time and it was never repaired. Hence no ACL. The article was written in 2012.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89771 Damon Allen was a pretty average QB who lasted a long time.facepalm statemetn of the year. Remember the Argos' '04 Grey Cup win? Allen was basically a game manager for them Umm he still won it, and at how old... Pretty impressive considering how banged up he got because of his playign style. 394 passing TDS and 93 rushing tds vs only 278 interceptions. 4 x Grey Cup Champ. 3 x Grey Cup MVP 1 time CFL MOP Yet he's a lucky, average, long long time QB according to some of you. Ridiculous. It's like you think to be a good QB you HAVE to be amazing at sitting in the pocket 90% of the time and have a completion percentage over 65. 11,920 career rushing yards. It's not a fluke he won 4 grey cups, it's harder to defend a guy that could do what he did as well as he did, then it is to defend an Anthony Calvillo. No different than saying a scrambling QB is better suited to the CFL. It comes down to game planning and having the right personnel surrounding him. With that many interceptions a QB should have over 500 touchdown passes. And no, I'm not going to google any of Calvillo's stats. I agree Mark, while I prefer a scrambler, realistically if the coach has a pocket QB and develops a system around him, that QB could succeed and vice versa obviously. There's so many variables that can make a QB great or craptastic and I think this is a great debate, seeing as some prefer a pocket QB and some prefer scramblers.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89776 I dont care what anybody prefers, the point is to call damon allen average is insane.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89777 For a guy getting his first real reps, marve looked pretty good. Thought Brohm looked really good too b4 getting hurt tho also. Honestly seen so many qbs over the years have better games than marve tho and those guys are long gone now. I'd like to see marve get a full game with the team to see what he can do, but... at the same time, This is Drew Willys team, Honestly tho, we are pretty much done now, suppose not technically but need so much help its crazy, hell bc isn't even guaranteed to get in right now but.... I think I'd play Marve this week just because, why not. Honestly might not be technically done but reality is we are so i'd like to see Marve play, I'd like to see some PR guys play too, give some other guys some chances these last 2 weeks. QB isn't the problem on this team, RB wasn't the only problem on the team, we got lots of issues, oline being the main one but we got lots of offensive issues still... Let's see a PR receiver get in there, see some of the other guys who have stuck around get some time to show what they can do too. Gotta find a guy to take Rombys spot next season, Let's see what the PR receivers can do.. Marve? B4 proclaiming him the be all and end all, i'd like to see what he can do with a few games under his belt.. Right now he's probably playing for the backup job next year... His numbers were just average tho but like i said for a guy getting his first real reps of the year, pretty decent.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89784 Read this: http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bigten&id=61338&src=desktopMaybe I'm wrong about this, but all that link says is that Marve was playing with a torn ACL at the time. Nothing about it healing afterward or him having surgery afterward to fix it or being removed etc.I'd like some clarification on this, because I have a real hard time believing that he's playing without an ACL in his left knee. I'm no medical doctor but the headline says he has no ACL. If you read the article it says he tore it for the 3rd time and it was never repaired. Hence no ACL. The article was written in 2012. I know. Your point?
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89785 Read this: http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bigten&id=61338&src=desktop Maybe I'm wrong about this, but all that link says is that Marve was playing with a torn ACL at the time. Nothing about it healing afterward or him having surgery afterward to fix it or being removed etc. I'd like some clarification on this, because I have a real hard time believing that he's playing without an ACL in his left knee. Marve's last injury in college was a minor tear of his ACL. He still definitely has an ACL in that knee and it can definitely be re-injured. The article's name has misled many to believe he has no ACL in his knee, which of course, would be physically impossible to play on. This is not my opinion, this is what Marve had to say about it in TC when he was questioned about it by the Free Press.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89786 I dont care what anybody prefers, the point is to call damon allen average is insane. The general lack of respect for Damon Allen is hard to understand. especially coming from people that seem to know something about football x's and o's
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89791 I dont care what anybody prefers, the point is to call damon allen average is insane. The general lack of respect for Damon Allen is hard to understand. especially coming from people that seem to know something about football x's and o's I'm old enough to remember him looking at his first read, not finding it open, and taking off. And if we all just sing kumbaya, there goes the debate.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89794 Damon Allen is likely the most overrated QB in CFL history. There's a reason he wasn't a first ballot HOFer despite his stats... Everyone knows he wasn't that good. The only thing he was really great at was staying injury free.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89808 Sigh... One game... Limited reps for each.... And we're dealing em for OL. Sigh. I'm sitting at a bar in Banff with 17to85 just face palming hard... And how are we going to protect Brink, Elliott and Goltz in the upcoming expansion draft? It's an embarrassment of riches!!!
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89809 Marve is certainly the most exciting QB on our roster. Doesn't make him the best, but when you're 6-9 and down by a few TDs to the best team in the league, it's nice to know the last 20 minutes won't be boring.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89811 I dont care what anybody prefers, the point is to call damon allen average is insane. The general lack of respect for Damon Allen is hard to understand. especially coming from people that seem to know something about football x's and o's Well many of us watched Damon Allen play for a lot of years... the guy was average just about every year of his career. I think he had maybe one year, and that was at the end of his career, where you could argue he was the best qb in the league. He played well in Grey Cup games but throughout the regular seasons? Average. Basically Kevin Glenn without the choking. Played a long time at an average level.I'd even go so far as to say a peak Glenn was a better qb than Damon Allen.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89831 I dont care what anybody prefers, the point is to call damon allen average is insane. One of the reasons he played for so many teams is because the guys backing him up were often thought to be better. He lost his job to Michael Bishop. Twice. He was smart and mobile. As a passer he left a lot to be desired. 23 seasons in the CFL - he passed for over 4,000 yards 4 times and 5,000 once. He passed for less than 3,000 yards 8 times. He was a decent combination of a game manager and a running QB. He did these things well enough to carve out a 23 year career, so no, that's far from average. It's pretty remarkable. As a passer, being average for 23 years will eventually get you to 70,000 yards. I respect him and his accomplishments, but when listing the top QBs in CFL history his name will never come to mind, and I don't think that's an oversight.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89832 Read this: http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=bigten&id=61338&src=desktopMaybe I'm wrong about this, but all that link says is that Marve was playing with a torn ACL at the time. Nothing about it healing afterward or him having surgery afterward to fix it or being removed etc.I'd like some clarification on this, because I have a real hard time believing that he's playing without an ACL in his left knee. I'm no medical doctor but the headline says he has no ACL. If you read the article it says he tore it for the 3rd time and it was never repaired. Hence no ACL.The article was written in 2012. I know. Your point? Maybe in the past 2 years he magically grew one.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89833 I dont care what anybody prefers, the point is to call damon allen average is insane. One of the reasons he played for so many teams is because the guys backing him up were often thought to be better. He lost his job to Michael Bishop. Twice. He was smart and mobile. As a passer he left a lot to be desired. 23 seasons in the CFL - he passed for over 4,000 yards 4 times and 5,000 once. He passed for less than 3,000 yards 8 times. He was a decent combination of a game manager and a running QB. He did these things well enough to carve out a 23 year career, so no, that's far from average. It's pretty remarkable. As a passer, being average for 23 years will eventually get you to 70,000 yards. I respect him and his accomplishments, but when listing the top QBs in CFL history his name will never come to mind, and I don't think that's an oversight. Sorry, maybe not to you but to just about everyone else.
October 20, 201410 yr comment_89838 Marve does have his acl in his left knee, it was repaired in 2013. http://www.cjob.com/2014/04/13/bombers-happy-with-day-one-of-mini-camp/ http://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/quarterback-robert-marve-s-late-game-performance-a-bombers-fan-favourite-1.1865994
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